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Wood Elf List
Galadrin
I think I am going to try out this non-traditional 1,500 pt Wood Elf list the next time I play, but I'd like to get your comments and thoughts first:

Thalandor (380 pts)
+ Magic War Paint, Talisman of Qwarr, Spear of Daith, Gwandor the Great Eagle

Chariot (100 pts)
+ Spears, Shields, Scythes

6 Glade Riders (186 pts)
+ Lances

18 Glade Guard (253 pts)
+ Shields, light armour, standard bearer
+ Banner of Shielding

9 Archers (99 pts)

10 Wardancers (200 pts)

Treeman (280 pts)

Total 1,498

Analysis
It's very low on characters (only one character, counting for not much more than 25% of the total point value) but Thalandor does double-duty as a general and a Master Mage (Level 3). I would give him Amber Magic which has a lot of spells that either disable individual models (Hunting Spear, Amber Trance, Writhing Worm) or boost him in combat (Savage Beast of Horros, Vengeful Hood). With the latter, he can take Gwandor and go wizard/war machine hunting.

The list is also very low on the traditional Wood Elf strong suit: archery. If I am facing an army that is very vulnerable to archery (High Elves and Dark Elves come to mind), I will drop some of the regiments and add archers in 9-man blocks (99 pts each). The Treeman alone (who would only be useful vs Cold One Knights) could be replaced by two more archer units and a unit of scouts (for a total of 32 arrow shots each turn).

The list is tailored so that I am not giving away extra VP's (i.e. I have tried to stick at or under 100 pt increments for every unit). The goal is to have as many striking units as possible in a small 1,500 pt army (a powerful chariot, some flexible skirmishing Glade Riders, the versatile Wardancers, the unstoppable Treeman, and Thalandor himself with enough magic boosts). That way, the enemy won't know from which direction the attack will come (the answer, of course, is "from every direction"!).

What do you think?
Edited by Galadrin on 04-09-2017 16:18
 
Geep
It's been a long time since I played 5th, but I like the list.

I ran Thalandor a few times. He never seemed to do well for me, either being out magicked or out-combated (or both! Damn Bret 75% characters...), but in theory he should be decent.

If the enemy has good shooting you can expect many of your units to evaporate. Similarly, you need to be getting the charges!

I've always had a soft spot for chariots- especially pre-8th ed. As with your other units, enemy shooting will be terrible to it (slaying the horses), but if it manages a supported charge it can easily tip a combat. Did you make a suitable model for it? If so, what from?

I love treemen, and in hindsight I always under utilised them in 5th ed. T7 gives immunity to S3, which is huge- combined with their inability to be broken unless wounded (I think that was 5th?) they can double as a hard-hitter or the ultimate tar pit.

When will the list see the table?
 
Galadrin
I have a few players at the club that are interested in starting up regular games of 4e/5e, but I want to get everything painted up before I put my army on the table (with the time it takes me to paint, probably the earliest game will be in the Fall). However, when that does happen, I'll definitely post some battle reports here!

I use Treemen mostly as knight-killers, since little else in the army can do that (just spells and the chariot scythes). They are good "sticking" units though (as are the Wardancers), as they won't break unless wounded and have Toughness 7 and a 5+ unmodified save. The Glade Guards are easily the weakest choice in the army... they are expensive, less maneuverable than everything else and usually accomplish little before they get chased off the table. My reason for including them is really just this: I love the models! I know many people hate the old Glade Guard sculpt, but it was the single model that got me into Warhammer.

I use the old GW mail-order Wood Elf Chariot that was offered by GW UK for a short while at the end of the 1990's. It's essentially the old one-man High Elf Tiranoc chariot with scouts for crew and overlapping yokes to make it a four-horse chariot (I only play it as a two-horse chariot though, since four-horse would put the unit over 100 pts and therefore worth 2 VP).
 
snyggejygge
If you play 5th edition with old victory points instead of the VP100 system then the chariot will be Worth 1 VP no matter if 98 pts or 199 pts, itīs 1 VP per full 100 (see Battle book page 40).

The wardancers would be better of 9 strong as they would then only be 1 VP

As for the list I like it, look like it could be fun to play & besides I was always a sucker for generals that could do double duty, my old Chaos army was usually led by a sorcerer since they were good in combat as well.
If someone starts being a douchebag you can easily fit a champion with Black Gem in there.
 
Galadrin
snyggejygge wrote:

If you play 5th edition with old victory points instead of the VP100 system then the chariot will be Worth 1 VP no matter if 98 pts or 199 pts, itīs 1 VP per full 100 (see Battle book page 40).

The wardancers would be better of 9 strong as they would then only be 1 VP

As for the list I like it, look like it could be fun to play & besides I was always a sucker for generals that could do double duty, my old Chaos army was usually led by a sorcerer since they were good in combat as well.
If someone starts being a douchebag you can easily fit a champion with Black Gem in there.


Oh crud, you're absolutey right! I've been playing that incorrectly for years! Well that really is a game changer... hrm, even a 199 pt unit is only 1 VP... that is going to change a lot of my armies.

I really do like this original VP system to the one where 1 pt = 1 VP. It forces you to be creative to get the most out of your regiments... plus, 199 pts is really a nice sweet spot for regiment size. It is about 20 Empire Halberdiers with command and champion, 5 Reiksguard Knights, 35 Goblins with command and champion, 20 Skeletal Warriors or Ghouls, 12 High Elf Swordmasters, 18 Dwarf Warriors, or 8 Chaos Warriors—all are good sizes for regiments in the game.

Ok, so NEW army list. I dropped a Wardancer and made the Chariot have four steeds and three crew. That oughta keep it safe long enough to deliver its deadly impact hits.

Thalandor (380 pts)
+ Magic War Paint, Talisman of Qwarr, Spear of Daith, Gwandor the Great Eagle

Chariot (121 pts)
+ Spears, Shields, Scythes, Extra Steeds, Extra Crewman.

6 Glade Riders (186 pts)
+ Lances

18 Glade Guard (253 pts)
+ Shields, light armour, standard bearer
+ Banner of Shielding

9 Archers (99 pts)

9 Wardancers (180 pts)

Treeman (280 pts)

Total 1,499

Alternatively, I could drop the Glade Guard down to 15 models, drop the Glade Riders down to 5 models, drop the shields from the Chariot and replace the third Chariot crewman with a Champion with Hail of Doom Arrow... The Hail of Doom Arrow might kill more enemies than three Glade Guard and a Glade Rider, but the annoying thing is that I'd always be at best 3+ to hit with it (BS 5 and -1 for the chariot moving every round) and that is at 18" short range (when in reality I should be declaring charges once I am inside of 18" ). Still, if I spend a turn to outflank a target regiment, it gives the chariot something to do on an otherwise wasted turn (fire two crew arrows and the champion's Hail of Doom Arrow).

What do you think? Bigger regiments are always safer, but the Hail of Doom Arrow is hard to ignore... when I take it, though, I usually put it on a Lord with a Great Eagle, Bow of Loren and either Shield of Ptolus or Potion of Strength).
Edited by Galadrin on 09-09-2017 08:51
 
snyggejygge
Hail of Doom Arrow is useful in many ways, can clear an entire chaff unit on its own, I see your dilemma, but I would still try the champion a game or 2 Before deciding, however is the best place for the champion really inside the chariot?
 
Galadrin
snyggejygge wrote:

Hail of Doom Arrow is useful in many ways, can clear an entire chaff unit on its own, I see your dilemma, but I would still try the champion a game or 2 Before deciding, however is the best place for the champion really inside the chariot?


I certainly could put him with the archers (raising that regiment's point value to 175, so still 1 VP). Alternatively, I could forgo the Hail of Doom Champion altogether and give the archers a Banner of Wrath... that is probably better use of the points, because it ignores armour saves and automatically hits. If I only got one round with the archer regiment (i.e. they get jumped by some harpies on turn 2), then the Hail of Doom is a better deal... if I get two turns then it is about even (2/3rds of the Hail of Doom hit so 2D6 on average, where as you would get two turns of 1D6 hits with the Banner of Wrath). If the archers survive for three turns or more, however, the Banner wins out. Of course, many Wood Elf armies would have both!

Ahh, I think I've found where I got the "1 VP for every 100 points or part thereof"... that was the rule in 4th Edition! A regiment that cost 101 points was worth 2 VP, because you always rounded up. GW changed this rule to "every full 100 points" perhaps to discourage small-sized regiments and much more likely to sell more models (of course). I like it either way, though! I'll start playing with the actual 5e rule for this and see how it changes my game.

Snyggejygge, let's see a new army list from you! I'd like to see how your Chaos list has changed over the years.
 
snyggejygge
Tbh I havenīt played 5th edition since last summer & not competetive since around 15 years ago.
I get to play 5:th edition roughly 3-4 games per year, all of them usually during a short time span when a friend of mine visits & we play for old times sake.
If I were to make a competetive army I would probably start with something like this:

Master Sorcerer on disc with Destiny of Tzeentch, Staff of Osiris & a scroll. (No need for level 4 imo)

Chaos Hero of Khorne on steed with either Flail of Skulls or Helm of Many Eyes & Jade Amulet.

Champion on steed with Black Gem of Gnar.

I prefer not using lords since there are so many answers to tooled up lords, I rather use the characters as suppor for my troops.

Units would be mostly mounted & fast chaff, Knights, marauder horsemen, chaos hounds. Allies: Harpies, Flamers & a Lone Dragon Ogre

Chaos in 5th felt a lot weaker than the 4th edition list due to the separation, but it was admittedly more balanced.
 
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